David Bolt, CEO, GMB
Rob Den Besten, COO, GMB

Interview Description
David Bolt (CEO) and Rob Den Besten (COO) of GMB joined us for a Deep Dive into their Team of Teams management system, which helps drive flexible and scalable change through all areas of the organization. Over the last three years, Team of Teams has changed the way GMB builds teams, connects disciplines, develops regional offices, grows empathy and trust within a multi-generational workforce, and structures the business itself. We also discussed the positive impact the Team of Teams system has had in helping GMB to navigate the coronavirus pandemic, manage knowledge, and prepare for an uncertain future.

Speaker Bios
David Bolt and Rob Den Besten have spent their entire careers working at GMB, both starting as architectural interns. Now as CEO, David is passionate about building GMB into a 'Team of Teams'. He believes that all people deserve to be the best they can be, to work in a place that cares about them as individuals with unique gifts and abilities, and to find the right place to grow their knowledge. His job is to inspire, lead, dream, and provide an environment for teams to learn, grow, and give.

As COO, Rob's passion lies in connecting GMB's offices in a way that elevates a 'Team of Teams' approach, fosters an empowered culture, and leads to everyone's growth. His role is to keep teams focused on reaching their goals, delivering amazing service, integrating the major functions of the business, and growing in knowledge. He believes in getting the right people in the right seats and removing obstacles so that they can be successful.

Interview Summary

00:40 Introduction to GMB

03:26 Q: Take us through GMB’s journey to a “team of teams” structure.
03:46 Growth and Identifying Priorities

05:35 Q: How did you change how you treat your people?
05:44 Discovering “Team of Teams”
07:22 People First Takes Work

08:30 Q: What is Teams of Teams and why did GMB adopt the model?
08:57 4 Principles: Building Trust, Exchange of Ideas, Common Goals and Purpose, Empowering Individuals

10:24 Q: What direction are you headed in?
10:40 Creating Lifelong Learners

11:00 Q: How do these principles break into an organizational design? What does the structure look like?
11:12 Creating Rhythms and Repetition
11:44 Non-Hierarchical Team Structure

13:10 Q: What’s an example of a team and what’s one of their scopes and decisions?
13:20 Pod Structure
14:20 Firmwide Assignment: What’s Our Flexible Future?
14:53 Building Trust & Empathy - 15 minutes daily
15:55 Summary of Pods Approach
16:30 90-Day Sprint Goals
17:00 Shuffling Pod Groups
17:22 Lifeline Exercise

18:25 Q: Can you talk about how change and trust go together?
18:40 The Future is All About Change
18:57 Change Requires Trust

20:00 Q: How did you knit together multiple offices with the pod system?
20:18 Building Connection with Cross-Office Pods

21:51 Q: Do you have to be in a pod?

22:15 Q: What were some of the objections early on?
22:22 Time Commitment & Purpose
23:04 Relationships Inspire Support

23:30 Q: Tell us about the 90-Day sprints.
23:44 Structure and Innovation

24:30 Q: What are some examples of a problem you have employees tackle as a group?
24:36 Multi-Office Communication, Flexible Future, Clients
25:00 Firmwide Finances
25:29 Experiment: Replacing Printouts with Collaborative PDFs

26:40 Q: What happens next when the pods are all meeting on these topics in parallel?
26:54 Topics Introduced at GMB University
27:20 30-Day Check-ins
27:45 60-Day Assessment
28:00 Inspiration from Lean A3 Formula

29:14 Q: What is GMB University and how does it interact with the pods structure?
29:36 Formalizing Knowledge Transfer
30:06 Two Day Off-Site for Entire Company

31:20 Q: How does GMB University relate to Coronavirus?
31:30 Team of Teams Structure Enabled Change
32:04 Virtual GMB University
33:21 Employee Survey

34:08 Q: How do you address introverts who want to keep personal & work life separate?
34:36 Fundamental Belief in Human Connection

36:22 Q: What is diversity like at your firm and is sharing different for women or people of color?
36:38 Gives Individual Employees Greater Voice & Empathy

38:26 Q: What is the onboarding process for new employees in existing pods?
38:42 Abbreviated Trust Onboarding

40:26 Q: Are the people within a pod also working on projects together?
40:50 “Super Teams” for Project Teams

42:40 Q: What does the process of moving people between pods look like?
43:08 Culture & Connection Team Evaluates Pod Makeup
44:05 Informal Leadership Training for Pod Captains

45:11 Q: How do pods share what they are learning with the rest of the firm?
45:25 Cross Pod Connections, Intranet

46:33 Q: How do you measure the success of the strategy?
46:36 Turnover Rate
47:05 Inter-Office Culture Transfer
48:03 Offices Feel Equal

48:50 Q: If you were going to start again, what would you do differently for someone starting on this journey?
49:08 Lead and Let Go

50:55 Q: Could you share more about the thought process about building pods?
51:14 Pods Inspired by Random Seating

53:08 Q: Is there influence from Lean / Agile / Scrum design?
53:30 Inspiration from Scrum
54:24 Using Scrum Tools to Connect People

55:06 We Don’t Track Hours!

Read the Collaborative Notes

Members of our team and the KA Connect community took collaborative notes during this Deep Dive using Google Docs. Collaborative note-taking helped us summarize key takeaways, collect related links, and will provide us with a quick reference when we return to this topic in the future. We've found the notes quite useful so far and hope you will as well.

Read Notes